Our son was not a psychopath: just VERY, VERY depressed. When someone is pushed beyond what they can handle, they snap. Stephen was pushed and pushed by Katie Tagle and others. Katie lied; she lied so much that when she was finally telling the truth, no one believed her. Not even us, and we loved her.
We are grieving. We loved both of them. If we could have stopped Stephen from killing Wyatt, we would have. Wyatt was 9 months and 27 days old the day he was killed. Wyatt was the sweetest, most lovable baby. He was our “chubby little cherub”. We ADORED him. Wyatt had that air about him that wherever you went with him, people would come over to see him. He would catch someone’s eye in a store or restaurant, give them that “smile” and like a bee to honey they would come.
Stephen did NOT beat Katie. All of this was a lie, a big story so she could feel better about herself for leaving Stephen and having an affair. They lived with us and we were very close to all four of them. If Stephen had beaten her, we would have seen or heard it.
Stephen was, however overwhelmed with taunting from Katie and her new guy and her ex-husband and a few of her friends. Pictures were sent to him that showed the new guy kissing Wyatt. The new guy taunted Stephen with “you’re out of the picture now, I’m going to be here for Wyatt.” They are all sick.
Here is a summary of what happened during their court cases and the night of the death of our son and grandson.
Stephen and Katie had their first court case with Judge Lemkau in Victorville. At that first court case, Judge Lemkau asked them if he were to let them take a little time to go out into the hallway, would they be able to work out a visitation agreement for Wyatt together. Katie did this. She didn’t have to. If she was so afraid for Wyatt, why would she give Stephen visitations? Also, they were unsupervised visits, based upon her terms.
After Katie agreed to the unsupervised visitations, she served him with papers for a restraining order that same day. So, the day after they appeared in the Victorville court, we went to court in Joshua Tree.
That second court case was when Katie asked the Judge for a restraining order from Stephen. That judge asked Katie why she had given Stephen nearly equal rights to unsupervised visits the day before, when she knew one day later she would be asking a judge to keep Stephen away from her. She told this judge that Stephen would not hurt Wyatt, just her.
This judge also asked how she would manage the baby exchange if she had a restraining order on the father, that she would have to have someone bring Wyatt to the exchanges because Katie would not be allowed to do so if there were a restraining order in place. The judge also asked Katie why she didn’t tell Judge Lemkau that she was going to ask for a restraining order the next day. If you look at the transcripts from this appearance, it will prove these questions were asked.
Their fourth court appearance was also in front of Judge Lemkau. Stephen really put a lot of time and effort into those court papers. We stayed up late on quite a few nights with him putting that together . . . if only Katie had put a little effort into hers. She needs to know that Stephen kept his real feelings hidden from all of us.
When Judge Lemkau said “all orders in place,” I wanted to shout out Hooray! When he came out with “one of you is lying” . . . David and I
were holding hands so tightly, not breathing! We so wanted the judge to see through Katie’s lies!
In that last court case on January 21, Katie asked to keep the restraining order in place, but she filed papers showing she wanted Stephen to have Wyatt Friday through Sunday, with one weekend a month going to her. Her request certainly did not show that she believed Stephen would hurt Wyatt.
The night of the tragedy, which was 10 days after their appearance in Judge Lemkau’s court, our family and friends were out looking for Stephen and Wyatt. I called Katie, I begged her to try and talk Stephen into meeting her somehow, with the police in tow. I pleaded with her to give him some hope, so maybe it would be just enough to get Wyatt away from him. Katie never left her house that night when everyone else was out frantically searching for them.
We begged the police not to “corner” them. David arrived seconds behind the police, ran out of his car, begged the police to let him talk to his son.
Instead, they handcuffed him, threw him into the back seat, and from there he had to learn the gory details of what was happening. David was locked into a police car right behind Stephen’s truck, in handcuffs, arms behind his back. Officers on the scene made him stay like this for two long hours. He witnessed the police joking, smoking, walking around . . . no one was talking to Stephen.
They had SWAT there. That was not in the papers! David saw them. If only they had not boxed Stephen in. Stephen was not “stuck” in a snow bank as the papers say. The police told David that when they pulled in, Stephen was backing up. All they had to do was allow Stephen to back out, get out of the way, and then they could have followed, maybe getting the two separated, saving Wyatt. I don’t know. If anyone was to blame, it is the police on duty that night for this blunder. Is it policy to chase an armed man into a corner when a child is also involved? They impacted the death of Wyatt more than a Judge could ever do with a “piece of paper.”
The next day when the police came to our home, the main detectives on the case, we asked WHY, WHY WHY would you corner a person in this situation? Why would you lock up Stephen’s father? Maybe he could have talked him out of it? Maybe he could have somehow grabbed Wyatt. He would have walked between a gun and our grandson.
After this was over, when we picked up Stephen and Wyatt’s stuff. We found that Stephen had “packed”: he had clothing, soap, shampoo, tons of food and diapers for Wyatt. He had over $1000 in cash. It did not appear that his plan was to die that night.
Hindsight is always 20/20. But based on what we had, based on watching the cruel mean things Katie and her “gang” did to torment Stephen, he snapped. You all can judge this however you want; we were there we saw it, we lived it and it was horrible. And we miss Wyatt too. Every second.
We have never blamed Judge Lemkau for any of this. He did what he had to do he obeyed the law. Judge Lemkau ruled based on the evidence placed before him. This was not mountains of evidence. The only one who knew of the piles and piles of postings on that website was Katie. We did not know Stephen had this site and was posting this stuff on it
until after all of this had ended. Only Katie knew, and she did not bring it to the court’s attention.
Signed,
David and Joan Garcia
Paging Sheriff Hoops… any comment? I mean, besides your six-sentence press release of January 31, 2010.
That was a completely one side story.
Oh sure lets just let a bad guy drive away, so we can follow him while he is driving 100mph + with a baby in the car; that’s much safer.
Seems like the parents knew he wanted to hurt the child that night, that’s why they were so desperate to talk with him.
Judge lemkcowered should not be rewarded for not doing his job; unless you work for ACORN and in that case he should be rewarded for doing nothing.
Has Lemcowered ever been elected?
I thought he was appointed.
The sheriffs were smoking and joking. Why did not they not attempt utilize David to talk to his son?
A very sad story indeed.
Just Saying…
I agree 100%. Completely one sided. I will not condemn the writer of the article because they are grieving for their son and grandson.
I do disagree that this is the Sheriff’s Departments fault. I also disagree with blame being laid on Lemkau, although, I do think he could’ve looked a little bit more into things. I am voting for Hosking, but only after Lemkau chose to dance around his words that he didn’t call Katie a liar. Additionally, I might add, I am not on Katies side as I am sure the sweet Katie we see now is not the same Katie Stephen or Lemkau saw for that matter.
With that said,
This was a tragedy at every angle. Hindsight most certainly is 20-20 and I am sure the parents of Stephen would’ve done things differently. I would wish that Stephen had the maturity (and Katie for that matter too) to put WYATT FIRST instead of themselves. Nobody, and I mean nobody had to die. Sadly, custody battles far too often turn out like this. Part of the grieving process is to assign blame. The only person who really dictated things that night was Stephen. He controlled the car he was driving and he controlled the gun he possessed.
Is it possible he snapped as indicated? Well, duh, obviously. But to assign blame? I believe in God. God had a better calling for Wyatt. Again, very sad sad story, but we should all really look at the big picture and not a bunch of finger pointing.
Condolences to all family and friends involved in this. Both sides. Truly tragic.
I cannot imagine the terror that David experienced handcuffed in the car unable to do anything while his son and grandchild were in peril.
So does this mean that the letter posted to Facebook by Stephen was a fake? Is that another cover-up?
Lots of denial going on here. Lots of denial. Murder-suicide brings out denial in peak form.
No offense to IePolitics, but why isn’t this in the SB Sun? What the hell do those people get paid to do? I get the feeling that half of this is “let’s crucify Lemkau because it’s more fun than actually doing our jobs.” All of the court information mentioned here is in transcripts–it’s not hidden away somewhere, and yet, no one ever reports on the history of court cases that happened before the final one. That’s just ridiculous.
I think that someone should contact Dr Phil and share this information with him. He had the mother on the show.
Also the grandparents should contact Ken and John and share this with them too.
Here’s the thing:
obviously, if the newspapers aren’t putting this up, they’re suspect.
If Tagle has allowed her story to be told without this information, then she’s suspect.
If the cops have kept this story out of the news, then they’re suspect.
So, you can’t get a straight story out of any of these people or groups (even though that’s THEIR JOB)…and so what did Lemkau do exactly besides tell Tagle that he thought she was lying (which, it sounds like she was). Anyone?
You know this is totally outrageous that this katie woman is being allowed to spew her garbage and when finally the parents get the courage to finally speak out on their son’s behalf NO ONE wants to get involved.They did’nt want their son’s side to go unheard .This katie sounds like she’s waiting for a movie of the week deal.Speaking out against this judge who was only going by what he had before him.All along this woman never asked for a restraining order for her son it was only for her. Then the most outrageous of them all is that the dad David could have tried to at least get the baby from Steven,but the cops did not or would not allow this father to talk to his son before he made this awful choice to hurt so many lives by taking his and and his son’s.This story is so sad and the justice system does fail many people it is flawed ,very flawed but this judge did not fail this woman who continues to do all these talks show and radio shows all the while knowing she not only had a hand in what happened but she egged him on into doing what he did.And not giving the court the info they really needed to step in does not fall on the judge it falls on this so called grieving mother.
First, my condolences to all who lost someone.
But denial isn’t a river.
She claims that Stephen didn’t beat Katie. By his own admission he did. She’s in denial or lying.
Blame the cops because they didn’t let Stephen go? If she wasn’t in denial maybe her son wouldn’t be a murderer. Maybe she could have gotten her son the help he so obviously needed.
I think the blame falls closer to Stephen’s parents then anyone else, besides their son. They are in total denial and the way they are trying to place blame on anyone else besides themselves and Stephen is ridiculous.
Maybe we should just do away with the police and just ask all the criminals to “Be Honest” and report to jail. They can stay until they decide they’ve stayed long enough and are rehabilitated.
Garcia’s, your son abused at least one women, one child and he was a coward. Suicide is the cowards way out. Accepting the facts may help in the grieving process. Placing inappropriate blame won’t.
I feel bad for David and Joan Garcia, but seriously, you can’t expect them to be impartial on this. If their son told them that Katie Tagle was lying about him abusing and threatening her, as well as bullying him, they’d probably believe it hook line and sinker. Me, I find those allegations hard to believe. Up until the murder-suicide, Stephen was sending Katie messages demanding that they reconcile, not that she leave him alone.
The saddest thing about this is that they were overjoyed when Lemkau called Katie Tagle a liar, when in reality, it was Stephen who was lying all along. I’m pretty sure they wouldn’t have been happy had Lemkau ruled the other way that day, but there’s a good chance their son and grandson would still be alive if he had.
Also, I think it’s clear from David and Joan’s account that the police acted appropriately. In hostage situations, it’s customary for the police to not do anything that would cause them to lose control of the situation, such as putting a family member in contact with the hostage taker, or allowing the hostage taker to flee with the hostage. The police were 100% correct in not allowing Stephen Garcia’s father to interfere, as well as for not allowing Stephen Garcia to leave.
Bob,
first off, if they can’t be impartial, then why do you trust Tagle to be impartial. She lost a son, they lost a son. Everyone wants someone to blame. Easier to blame Lemkau then admit that maybe she shouldn’t have harrassed her ex-boyfriend.
Second, and most important, what honest innocent people do you know who lie. The police weren’t covering their … because they were doing everything by the books and Tagle isn’t mentioning the previous court dates because they don’t matter. They’re avoiding those subjects or outright lying about them because it hurts the stories they’ve fabricated. In my experience, people lie because they’re guilty.
I think what this shows is just how convoluted everything is and was. Judge Lemkau honestly didn’t do anything wrong in my opinion, but he is such an easy scapegoat. It looks like there is just so much more to the story and once again, so very convoluted.
I wish Judge Lemkau gave Steven a trip to the mental hospital for an observation at least. That would of saved Lemkau perhaps.
Do your job:
So far I haven’t seen any real evidence of Katie Tagle lying about or bullying Stephen Garcia, nor have I seen any evidence of recklessness or a cover-up on the part of the police. Stephen’s parents make the accusations and suddenly it’s true?
Also, neither Lemkau nor his supporters have given any reason why he was so insistent that Katie was lying that day. He has said is that he couldn’t authenticate the emails, but it’s pretty clear from the transcript that he had his mind made up well before the hearing began.
You cant be serious about stephens parents having to be the blame? The only one to blame is the person who is not here anymore. Im sure if katie did not cry wolf so many times, they would have believed her. Also, why did it take her 10 days to contact the police after she had already had the letter she showed in court?
Calling Sgt. Charbi, why did your sheriff (HOOPS)cover UP this mess?
Calling Charbi?
Ask Hoops to tell us what was going on here.
Let us call the media, shall we.
DO Your Job…This was sent to several news papers in So. Cal. and John and Ken. They where not interested in the story. Bob…try reading all the court transcripts not just parts, also the police have all the documentation on the harassment and lies by Katie and her friends and ex husband, including texts, phone recordings, e-mails,video, photos and police reports. A lot of this is in the court papers that the judge read and used to make his decision. And as far as Stephen “admitting” to beating Katie that was taken from Stephens letter which has been altered several times. “PUNCHING” was in quotes it was sarcastic. quotes where removed by the media.
Elouise… Your not far off on the movie deal…. apparently no one noticed that the PR machine pushing Katie on to shows and on trips belongs to Hosking…hmmm
OH….The reason the police have all the info is because Stephen documented everything and put it on his computer, which was given to the police at Stephens request so someone would have all the story
Mike Tate send me an email and I will give you instructions to make a public records request. This forum is not the setting for this matter. jcharbonneau@sbcglobal.net
Wasn’t the time to make the matter of public record back when the sherrif made his press release? Before he allowed the whole issue to become a public spectacle? Just saying.
Mark, that’s the most sanctimonious thing I’ve ever read. I’m guessing the Garcias were so blinded by grief over the deaths of their son and grandson that they are only now starting to come back to the “real” world.
HMMMMM, did you read “Victorville Vultures in the Hosking Cult”? Very thought-provoking. It’s here: http://tinyurl.com/23tub2b
where is sgt on this one?
Why didn’t the media look any closer at Alan Boinus? He is a career “outraged member of the public” all the way from Laguna Beach. Just google him. He already had a lawsuit against him for talking an old lady into selling her life story to him for a $1 when he was her business manager. I just find it creepy that with his background managing people and trying to sell movie rights he put a target on Katie Tagle and her family. Who is looking out for them?
Yes, Katie signed a pledge from what I hear that she will never personally profit from her son’s tragedy. But this does not prevent other people around her from selling their stories. I could never imagine people trying to take from her.
The RemoveLemkau movement has been nothing but rude, hostile, and vile toward the campaign of Ed Montgomery. We have had rumors spread that they work for the campaign of Lemkau – when the links between Lemkau’s campaign and that of Victor Stull are so strong anyone can see them.
Ed has shown nothing but compassion toward the Tagle family, he wrote a letter explaining why in standing California law Judge Lemkau erred. There is nothing more that they can ask of him.
These are not people sincerely concerned about reform or true discourse about family court issues. All they want is to burn Lemkau at the stake. Which ironically they could do AND Elect Ed Montgomery.
Leaves you only to question their other motivations……
Vic Stull = Robert Lemkau
Rick Young who is Vic Stull’s official spokesperson and in deep (read his 460) wrote letters refuting Hoskings claims that Lemkau had been blanket papered and supports Lemkau as well. Vic Stull and Robert Lemkau have identical experience. Just look at the signage for the two guys together using the same sign hanging route taping their signs together up on Foothill in Upland.
How do people concerned about this one case push Vic Stull to be elected?
To Mr.David Garcia.
The police if possible cannot let ANY suspect continue to move freely once he has stopped or got stuck where ever.
Keeping an armed suspect CONTAINED, whether it be in a house,car or building, or even in an open field if he is on foot, is the primary objective of the police.
Containment means, to surround or block the escape of the suspect.
All persons under these circumstances are considered armed, whether or not the police have seen a gun or any other weapon.
I heard there was at least a 5 man SWAT team that was there that night. When they arrived I do not know.
Mr.Garcia there was no WAY those cops were going to allow you to walk up to your sons car and start talking to him. NO WAY!!!!
NOT that day or any other day under these circumstances.
IF and I SAY IF, your son was still alive and had not shot himself when you arrived and was talking to those Deputies, or showing signs of life.
Then they could have allowed you to speak with your son. IF is a big word in these tragic situations.
NOT by walking up to his car, but by cell phone, public address system on the police car or by voice if your close enough and your safety and those of the Deputies are not in danger.
BUT if those cops had a reason for not allowing you to speak with your son, then I would hope they told you at some point WHY they did not.
Being handcuffed and placed in the back of the car I too understand.
I understand your emotions upon arriving there and seeing what you saw. I have seen that emotion many times and it is VERY understandable.
But if those Deputies felt your emotions were so high that you would do something foolish or make a run for your sons car in an effort to speak with him, THEN I fully understand their reasons for hand cuffing you.
But if your son was already deceased, then SOMEONE should have taken you home right away instead of allowing you to sit in that patrol car for the time you say you did.
Having you sit there and watch what you did was very insensative and there was no reason for it.
And for those of you who still demand Lemkau’s head, when the Sheriff’s Department printed the news article they did, and as of today, have still not responded publicly to this incident, YOUR the ones our public officials want voting for them.
And for those who do not know, Sheriff Hoops, his command staff, and the newspapers read this blog, EVERY single day.
And more than once a day.
Mr.Garcia, I only have one question of you if your reading this.
Sir, how did you know the Deputies were chasing or following your son?
Garcia family: Your letter makes me soooo mad! It is obvious that stephen never had to own up to anything. You ran interference for him. You say you never saw or heard any abuse by stephen…He was under your roof and you didn’t see that he was so screwed up that he would murder his own son. You missed alot. So much so I feel you are to blame also. You should have been a safety net for your grandson. You didn’t stand up in court and tell anyone he was depressed. You sat there and held your breath that judge lemkau would punish Katie further. Quit blaming the cops and Katie. The only people to blame in this is your murdering son and yourselves for not protecting Wyatt.
Grrrr…I just read your letter. Is there something wrong with you? I don’t care if you think you’re right. You don’t say stuff like that to people. It’s amazing that in a race that is pretty much put to bed already where Hoskings seems like a sure thing that there are people who feel like they have to go onto the internet and act this way towards other human beings–people who have lost a son and a grandson. It’s sickening, and even more so that people with this little in terms of personal responsibility and morality are able to justify giving others lectures in morality.
Although the grandparents on both sides of the families are victims too, Stephen Garcia had issues and Judge Lamekau did not handle this situation at all properly. Whenever a child’s life is threatened, the judge should do all he can to make sure the child is protected. Plain and simple. I read the transcript. The judge was a fool. Say good bye to Judge Lamekau and hello Judge James Hoskin. =]
This just seems inane!! The Judge is being blamed and I don’t exactly get why. Unless everyone else has seen the file, I think it’s apparent he was going on a lot more than what we, the public, know. Maybe the craziness around this case has to do with a twerp named Hosking, who saw it as something he could take advantage of. I honestly don’t understand how anyone could possibly vote for Hosking. After doing a little research, I discovered he doesn’t live in San Bernardino, has barely 10 years experience as a lawyer, no family law experience, was arrested for drunkenness in public…I could go on and on. Really people, that’s who you want as a judge…come on now.
What makes this really interesting is how in contrast the Garcia account is to the Press Release by Hoops that states:
“On January 30, 2010, the Hesperia Sheriff’s Station received a report that a 25 year old male took his son during a court ordered visitation and threatened to kill his child and then commit suicide.
On January 31, 2010 at approximately 1:30 a.m., Deputies from the Twin Peaks Station later located a vehicle along a rural dirt road in Twin Peaks. The male subject and his 9 month old son were located inside the vehicle. Both sustained traumatic injuries and were pronounced dead at the scene.
The San Bernardino County Sheriff’s Homicide Detail was requested by the Twin Peaks Sheriff’s Station and are currently conducting an investigation.
The investigation is on-going at this time. Anyone with additional information about this incident is encouraged to contact Detective Ryan Ford or Sergeant Frank Montanez at the Sheriff’s Homicide Detail at 909 387-3589.”
That statement vs. the common knowledge there was a police pursuit, is what makes it look as though there has been a cover up.
Amazed: Are you aware you are on an opinion page? It was just my humble opinion. I guess you find it OK that the Garcia’s point the finger at Katie for causing what happened. If not I will expect the same care bear attitude for them. If lemkau (I kinda like lemcoward) needed to err he should have err’d on the side of the innocent….Wyatt. Stephen is a murderer…and his parent’s should have protected Wyatt. They say they knew he was depressed. They didn’t seek help for him? They didn’t keep a closer eye on him? If he goes out and off’s himself….oh well…but he was so selfish that he would kill his son to get back at Katie. Grandparents should just grieve their loss and quit trying to justify the unjustifiable. Again IMHO
This case clearly show the cycle of violence. Katie was a victim of Stephen Garcia and the system that failed to see that this was clearly a case entwined with domestic violence. Baby Wyatt would be alive today if the system had not failed Katie, the system is broken and will be fixed one judge at a time.
To Gets Better All the Time – again is it now or later that you would like to disclose that you are Ed Montgomery’s daughter? Stop the mudslinging you and only you are responsible for hurting your dad’s campaign.
Yes, Grrrr! I am aware that this is an opinion page. In my opinion you have no moral character. Chastistizing grieving parents and grandparents and blaming them for the death…do you know the meaning of responsibility? No. Obviously not. Do you know what it’s like to deel with anyone with depression? No, again. Don’t stand behind the “it’s just my opinion” shield. That’s justified every horrible thing that’s ever happened anywhere. Take some responsibility for yourself and form better opinions.
Hey Justice – What isn’t true? I’ve tried to sit down and keep quiet but this is just so petty!
Alan Boinus IS a “consultant” from Laguna Beach . And the old lady that GetBetterAllTheTime mentions is a Holocaust survivor. What kind of person steals the life story of person who has already been through that kind of horror. But I can’t post the links – site rules.
Someone in the RemoveLemkau group has been spreading rumors that my daughter was flirting and giggling with Lemkau at the Big Bear Forum on May 4. Which is so obviously not true as she is happily married with FOUR kids and lives in Las Vegas.
My husband has written a letter for Katie and offered to help her since he has been to Sacramento before to lobby for children’s bills. If RemoveLemkau really wanted to accomplish a POSTIVE change for reform, he would have been more than willing to help. Instead we have been vilified and lied about.
Vic Stull has a common link to Robert Lemkau – Rick Young. Just as GetBetterAllTheTime posted.
It’s not mudslinging if it’s TRUE.
And yes, I’m Ed Montgomery’s wife.
What is this fixation on Ed’s daughter?
Have you even met her? She was out at the Tea Party last night. She will be out at all of Ed’s events this weekend.
Not one of you have the courage to talk to her to her face. Not even James Hosking has the courage to talk to her. He had the opportunity. Instead he spoke softly under his breath trashing her campaign just 6 feet away. He wanted to avoid being called on the nasty unfounded rumors that his followers spread.
All you do is attack her – but you never answer to point. This is the game of weak women when they have a much stronger more intelligent adversary.
This is why you take it so hard when she uses one of her favorite phrases “The Intellectually Unarmed – Throw Stones.” All you have is bucket of rocks for the woman.
She has helped many campaigns of candidates that she strongly believes in. Ask around. The other campaigns have nothing bad to say about her except for you.
If you knew anything about running a campaign you would have called her to start with, no one else knows the numbers in this campaign better than her. No one else understands the history of the judges races like her. Does it hurt when she calls your race another Caldwell/Barr affair because its true or because you don’t even know what that is?
As for who I am – does not matter – until you and your group answer any of the very valid questions out there.
It appears that the entire movement to replace sitting Judge Lemkau with deputy district attorney James Hosking is simply another attempt to pack the court with another Ramos hack. Hosking admits that, while a DA, he became so drunk that he was arrested, convicted, and placed on probation. Yet, DA Ramos did not fire him!!! AND, Ramos endorses him as a judge!!!! Anything to increase the membership in the Good Old Boys Club.
http://blog.thomaspaineproject.org/2010/05/31/the-citizencandidate.aspx#Comment
To Amazed: I said the same thing as Grrrr but maybe a little less direct. They knew he had issues and didn’t do anything to help the situation. They could probably be held liable for their participation, but one would have trouble finding an impartial jury. And who wants to press the issue when they lost a son.
You can walk through life blaming others for your faults and problems and be bitter; or you can use your experiences, accept your responsibilities and be a mature adult. He didn’t have to be so blunt, but you don’t have to be in denial, either. Stephen pulled the trigger, but they helped him get there.
Why do you assume that people who disagree with you are naive? Do you find the world full of naive people. I don’t disagree with you because I’m naive, desertdog, I disagree with what you and Grrrr are saying because it’s slimy. The reason you wouldn’t be able to find an impartial jury is because most people have consciences. Stephen pulled the trigger. Parents of the mentally disturbed are no more responsible for their children then their ex-girlfriends who have children with them. People aren’t psychic–they don’t know what’s going to happen. I’m done with the flamewar with you two. Honestly, if you are really Hosking’s fans, then you might want to shut up. You make his supporters look vile.
How athletic are you that you can leap that far? I didn’t say anyone was naive. I said denial. Two different things.
I’m a fan of the truth and owning up to your failures. It’s not slimy to tell the truth. You just don’t like it because sometime the truth hurts.
These people admit their son had issues but fail him by not getting him help. Your right that we can’t tell the future. And no parent wants to believe that their child would be capable of such a heinous act. I’m sure that the truth lies somewhere between the two stories but their story is not the closer of the two.
Not finding an impartial jury is because so many people like you would take pity on them and not see the whole situation for what it is.
They have my sympathy, not because of their story but because they will never even come close to healing if they can’t see the truth. Misplaced blame won’t help them.
This thread is hilarious. I know James Hosking, and I just want to state a few things (although, given the tone in this thread, I’ll probably be called a shill or a liar):
To “Hmmmm…” – You say Hosking has a PR company controlling Katie? Hosking doesn’t even have a PR guy like Lemkau does (Jay Shotwell PR). Hosking had one guy who brokers “slate mailers” (those election info-cards you get in the mail), who heard James on John & Ken and got James some placement at wholesale. James & his wife have completely run his campaign from their home office otherwise.
To “East End” – Hosking is a “Ramos Hack”? James asked both Ramos & Hoops for endorsements. Ramos told James that James would make an excellent judge, but that he would not officially endorse James – because when Ramos took a side in the Caldwell/Barr race, it pissed off 1/2 of his deputies. Hoops wouldn’t even return James’ calls – too controversial to oppose the “old boys club” of judges.
To the general “Hosking is using Katie” thing – James refused to contact Katie when he decided to run (even though several people told him he should). He said “if she wants to hide under a rock, or come out and fight Lemkau head on, either way is fine”. Katie’s sister (sorry, don’t know name) saw an article about James running against Lemkau and called him. James said they were wary of him at first – not knowing who he was. But now, every time Katie sees James she gives him a big hug – as do Katie’s mother and grandmother. THEY thank HIM every time they see him . . . and HE turns right back around and thanks THEM. I think Tuesday is going to be hard on everyone involved in this race.
And . . . can I just point out this nugget – Lemkau told the Victorville Daily Press that he didn’t have enough experience to comment on the question “What would you do to improve the criminal law courts?” Not joking. 37+ years in the court system as a DA & Judge . . . Wow.
I’m linking the scanned image that Hosking has posted on his website – I think you just click my name to read it.
I know both Hosking and Lemkau, having worked with both of them as Deputy DA’s, and there is honestly no comparison in legal knwledge and ability. Hosking is a legal scholar and Lemkau is a dim bulb. I was amazed when I learned he had been appointed as a judge.
Regarding the Tagle incident, Lemkau ignored the threatening e-mails sent by Garcia, no matter what his parents say. If anyone has listened to the transcript of the hearing, Katie begged Lemkau to read them and he refused.
As for the “papering” of Lemkau, I talked to several deputy DA’s who told me that is exactly what happened. The only reason they did not paper Lemkau is because the Presiding Judge put him into Family Law, where they thought it wouldn’t matter if he ran a circus of a courtroom. Boy, were they wrong!
I dare anyone to have a conversation with Lemkau on any complex legal issue (the kind we expect judges to decide) and come away feeling that Lemkau understood it. There is just no “there” there. The lights may be on, but nobody’s home.
Plenty of folks are disagreeing w/ you over here, Sarge:
http://iepolitics.com/2010/05/06/iepolitics-lemkauhosking-race/#comment-9300
To Do your job…
The reason why much of what is contained here is not in the press is because the written press is a joke in this county. There has not been an investigative reporter in this county since Sara Carter left. The San Bernardino Sun, Daily Bulletin, and Press Enterprise neither have the qualified personnel, money, nor the desire to do investigative reporting.
The Wall Street Journal now has a West Coast Bureau in Los Angeles, and are looking to expand. Send newsworthy information to them. Get them familiar with this county now to develop interest.
“Plenty of folks”? Or one person who refers to James by “Jimmy” – giving away the fact that he/she is probably just a Lemkau shill, because James goes by “James” in court, and some of his close friends call him “J”).
Ugh this is just silly. Hopefully the voters kick Lemkau out tomorrow.
Praying for you, James!
Montogmery’s Wife & Gets Better All the time – the sleazy mud-slinging you did here is despicable and disgusting.
This election is one of the dirtiest I have seen for a local race – three words come to mind re: your posts – ignorant, shameful, pathetic.
Your ugly distortions reek of ignorance and desperation – with friends like these, it’s no surprise that Montgomery was defeated in the election.
In a typical scumbag smear tactic, you falsely twist facts into lies, in order to fit your OWN SLEAZY, DESPICABLE, SMEAR CAMPAIGN AGENDA.
It comes as no surprise that it turns out that you don’t have the faintest idea what you are talking about – your posts proves that you either are knowingly spreading lies, or you are completely ignorant.
Either way, you should be ashamed of yourselves and your idiotic behavior. You’re idiots spreading lies.
You should be get your facts straight before you start trying to trash people’s good names. You can be held accountable for twisting the truth and spreading lies about people.
For example: re: the man you referred to as a “career outraged member of the public” who you imply took advantage of an elderly lady, saying there was a “lawsuit against him for talking an old lady into selling her life story to him for a $1” – it turns out you were COMPLETELY WRONG about the guy.
The guy was completely VINDICATED of any wrongdoing after the lawsuit – the elderly lady felt so bad about for suing him, she apologized to him for filing the lawsuit at all – and she then THANKED HIM for his help.
All parties (including the elderly lady) agreed the guy had done NOTHING WRONG.
See this link:
http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/irene-gut-opdyke/book.html
“In an ironic twist after the trial, all parties agreed that the promoter had done “nothing wrong.” Mrs. Opdyke publicly acknowledged the promoter whom she had sued by thanking him in her book, In My Hands, and agreed to give him producer credit for the eventual “authorized” motion picture about her life story.”
FIRST:
The true facts of that situation were that the guy did NOT take advantage of the elderly lady at all.
Re: the $1 option agreement – it’s obvious that you don’t know anything about standard business practices/standard options/legal agreements in Hollywood.
A $1 option agreement is just the nominal fee (part of a standard legal agreement) that is the standard amount for legal purposes that a person receives for the moment under the option agreement (as part of licensing the rights to their story), while the business manager goes out to pitch the story to Hollywood studios, to see if any are interested in making the person’s life story into a movie.
The $1 option amount is done ROUTINELY and is standard business practice in Hollywood – that’s how it’s done, and how movies get made.
Basically, that $1 nominal payment represents the person assuming their own risk – like the business manager saying, “OK, I’ll try to pitch your life story to movie studios – if they are interested, they will make a contract with you to pay you a 6-figure sum for the rights to your story – if no one is interested, you get the rights to your life story back, no harm no foul.”
His business manager role was to try to help the lady get a movie deal with Hollywood by “optioning” the rights to her life story.
An “option” is a standard legal agreement – it’s a license to pitch stories to movie studios for a set period of time.
An option is basically a temporary license, set to expire in a specific amount of time, during that time, a business manager is allowed to try to pitch a story to a movie studio to see if they’re interested in making the person’s life story into a movie – with the understanding that if no studios are interested, the person gets the legal rights back to their life story after that set period for the option expires.
Everyone in Hollywood knows that nobody pays big money up front for a movie that hasn’t happened yet.
That’s the reason for the nominal $1 payment – the lady was assuming her own risk while the guy tried to pitch her story to movie studios.
Anyone trying to help the lady get her life story made into a movie would have followed that same $1 standard option agreement protocol.
So the guy did NOT take advantage of the lady at all – he was simply following standard Hollywood business practice to try to get movie studios interested in making her life story into a movie – the lady herself later said he had done nothing wrong, and in fact THANKED HIM for his help.
SECOND:
The guy in fact HELPED the elderly lady to land a BOOK DEAL with Random House, which published her life story as an autobiography.
See this link:
http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/irene-gut-opdyke/book.html
So “Montgomery’s Wife” &Gets Better All the Time – you better get your facts straight before you attempt to trash someone’s good name – or you may find yourselves the subject of a lawsuit.
This is facinating. A whole lot of mudslinging took place in this election and it was not from us.
Go ahead call me an idiot. I welcome it. But you still don’t answer why it took someone not even from this county to be the outraged organizer.
Trashing reputations became the bloodsport of your campaign so get over it. The story is told the tale is at its perfect climax, but wait, oh no, motives are now questioned about why someone already connected with option agreements traveled at least a good 3 hours each way to lead a “citizen’s group” in Victorville all the way from Laguna Beach?
Anyone who has watched Lifetime Network, Oxygen, or any women’s drama knows that it is just a matter of time before the story is brought to the screen.
Tap dance around it all you like if everyone was happy there never would have been a suit filed. People “thank” others in the terms of settlements all the time to preserve professional reputations.
Perhaps the gig is up and no one wants to option anything with this public connection made.
Yes, if this same person goes forward as the publicist, business manager, and/or agent for Katie Tagle a few heads will be marveling if the boundaries were pushed in the campaign to remove Lemkau to make the story more attractive for a potential sale.
This is California with plenty of agents who can handle the book deals and movies outside of the guy who ran the coalition to remove the judge if his motivations were entirely outside that of his personal gain.
I applaud the family if they are weighing their options outside of the first person to come knocking.
All he has to do to preserve that reputation is walk away, just walk away. Demonstrate the most upstanding of ethics by having another party handle the entirety of the media management from this point forward now that your election is won.
Repeating what is easily googled is not trashing a good name when its a lawsuit that was dismissed with prejudice.
Go take the lawsuit threats to google, the papers whom still publish online the facts of the case, or any other number of source materials including the LA Times.
A lawsuit dismissed with prejudice simply means that the plaintif cannot refile. If it had been dismissed without prejudice, then there might be some credence to the argument that the case had merrit. Without prejudice is as close to a finding for the defendant as can be had without a full trial.
To david Garcia, u are the reason why tht piece of shit son of yours was so fucking twisted! People !!!!! did u not read ‘stupids’ letters to Katie, over and over he talked about his father nt being there for him! Etc etc. He obviously was a traumatic kid. So David and Joanne Garcia you and only you are to blame for creating such a fuck up! He should killed u instead. U did him wrong not tht beautiful angel sent from god! Shame on u ignorant people for blaming others for what the sick fuck did. I will pray for Katie no mother deserves this. Ever!
All this ramble about “katie lies” “katie affair” “katie new boyfriend” is basically all void, in the comparison to the real issue, that it was their son who killed their grandchild. They need to face facts and know that they SHOULD NOT have coddled their son if they, in their own writing, knew that he was “depressed”. If they knew he was depressed, then they should of had enough sense to take him to a hospital or even talk to him. Katie filed a restraining order because that is the day Stephen made the threat.
To say that just because your son and his wife lived with you in the same house, that that somehow means it is impossible for abuse to happen. You seriously think if someone wants to abuse someone else, that they would do it in front of you? That they would want you to know? If Stephen did abuse Katie, then he obviously did it when they were alone, it is certainly not impossible to believe. And verbal abuse is just as bad, and cyber abuse needs to get more attention in the media.
And to all the judges that “handled”, using the term loosely, this case, they are a pure joke and shouldn’t be in the judicial system. They are danger to Families seeking some kind of compromise. I hate when people kill others AND THEN kill themselves. Every time I hear about those situations, I wish hard that these so-called “snapped” victims will just turn their anger on themselves first and let who ever they are holding hostage go free.